Trudi Lebron Transcript
Sometimes life can seem stacked against us from the earliest age. Imagine having two children as a 16-year-old high school dropout … and turning all that around to support multi-million dollar executives and entrepreneurs transform their lives?
I’m Melinda Wittstock and today on Wings of Inspired Business we meet an inspiring entrepreneur who has learned from her struggles and challenges how to leverage business for social good.
Trudi Lebron calls herself a “straight-up BADASS.” This former teen mother of two and high school “opt-out” is now a business coach and impact strategist specializing in supporting entrepreneurs and multi-million-dollar executives in the personal development and transformation industry – and you’re going to love today’s episode because we talk social mission, diversity and much more.
Trudi Lebron is a force of nature who has overcome much in her own life to help her clients co-create inclusive, impactful communities, and prepares them to scale in our shifting social climate. Today we’re going to dig deep into what it takes for white business owners to create and lead a truly diverse team. Trudi says it starts with inner work, much like overcoming money mindset issues.
Trudi says she’s is a compassionate yet no-nonsense rule breaker who has been carving out her own path for the last 23 years. By the time Trudi was 16, she had two children and had dropped out of high school… all the odds were against her.
Today, Trudi is a sought-after coach for entrepreneurs, nonprofits, and corporate institutions helping them create social impact initiatives, and train leaders to lead with a lens for equity, diversity, inclusion, and impact. Her experience of being a bi-racial teen mom on welfare who worked her way up in the non-profit sector while building her own business gives her a unique perspective on using our businesses for social good.
Today she shares her personal journey from being a teen mom to becoming a successful entrepreneur, as well as how she helped businesses like Hay House publishing to attract African American team members and authors.
Ready to put your Wings on with Trudi Lebron? Let’s fly.
Melinda Wittstock: Trudi, welcome to Wings.
Trudi Lebron: Thank you so much for having me.
Melinda Wittstock: I am so excited to talk to you because I think we share a mission or a vision and that is of entrepreneurs and business leaders really leveraging business for social impact that together and individually we can do a lot with our companies to really improve the world in myriad ways. Now, this is close to your heart and I want to know what was the aha moment that made you the type of values driven entrepreneur that you are?
Trudi Lebron: I think it was less of an aha moment and more of just how I was raised. So I was raised pretty much in the nonprofit industry. My mom was the executive director and my whole life worked in leadership and nonprofits. I grew up right alongside her, watching her advocate for people who needed help, who needed housing, who needed their lights turned on, who needed food. And so I got to kind of up close and personal view of what that work was like. And then as a young mom, I dealt with a whole bunch of issues and poverty and struggle to kind of fight for every little thing that I could put together.
Trudi Lebron: And so when I got to be an adult and was working in the nonprofit industry, that just really shaped a lot of my views about the way that we should be working and the way that we should be earning and what we should be doing and what the potential is for how we can be doing these things differently to make an impact on the people around us.
Melinda Wittstock: I want to talk to you about what it was like being a 16-year-old mom of two in just a moment though. First, I want to pick up on this, the nonprofit piece because I so many women entrepreneurs in my experience have gravitated traditionally towards nonprofits to begin with. And it began to sort of bug me. I had a nonprofit for a while, very early on in my entrepreneurial career, and I think it's because we're so mission-driven, perhaps we thought that was the only way you do mission, but now it's really changing. It's sort of like the world is waking up that actually, no, you can do mission and be profitable at the same time. Was there a light bulb that went off for you about switching you from the nonprofit into the more for-profit area?
Trudi Lebron: Yeah, absolutely. It was after being in leadership in the nonprofit sector. I had a really successful career in the nonprofit sector and in the educational world, and realizing that what was happening was that people were working really hard to get advanced degrees and spending lots and lots of money to get these positions that we're not paying them equitably. Not paying them the kind of salaries that we're going to be able to help them pay their student loans back, and realizing that a lot of the folks in leadership in that sector are just a couple of paychecks away from really, really struggling, and that was a scary scenario for me to realize.
Trudi Lebron: I also had just personally the kind of personality that I wanted to work for myself. I didn't want to go to work every day. I didn't want to go to a business every day. I didn't want my time to be micromanaged. And so when I started to launch kind of like a side hustle consulting practice, the moment that I realized that I could actually pay myself was… It was a huge light bulb moment, and I remember sitting with a coach and sharing my business plan with this coach in an incubator, business incubator that I was in. And she said to me, “Well, why does your budget… Why do your projections all end in zero?”
Trudi Lebron: So it's like you put your expenses and what you're going to pay yourself and what you might pay employees, and everything ended up in zero. And in a nonprofit world, that's what you have to do. All the money you bring in, you have to spend.
Melinda Wittstock: You have to spend. I know exactly. In fact, I remember having a deal. I had some grant for my nonprofit and I underspent, and I thought that was a good thing because I was being really efficient but I thought the money yanked away from me.
Trudi Lebron: Yeah. You had to send the money back. It's bad. And that can affect the funding in the future. They will send you less in the future.
Melinda Wittstock: Right. Which is that is just completely the wrong incentive. It drove me crazy.
Trudi Lebron: Right, exactly. So because I had been trained in that model and I was trained really, really well in that model. I had managed federal grants, like millions of dollars in grants and I switched over to business and I'm designing my business plans to end in zero and this coach was like, “You can make money. You can actually have money leftover.” It seems so simple.
Trudi Lebron: When they said it, I was like, “Oh, obviously that's the whole point, right?” Or one of the points. But it was so ingrained in me that that wasn't something that you should do and that that wasn't a good thing that I didn't even consider that. And I started thinking a lot. I'm trained as a social psychologist. So of course, I started to obsess over why that's true and started doing all of that. I was like, “Wow, there's so many people walking around with that mindset that we're lucky to have a job.” I call it the nonprofit mindset that you're lucky to have a job that it's not about the money. You're not in it for the money. You overwork. You're always working more than 40 hours a week and you do it because you have a mission and you're a good person.
Trudi Lebron: That's like the mindset. So once I started to realize that this was not a sustainable practice like the nonprofit sector, and decided that I was going to go out and do my own thing, I really had to start confronting those mindset challenges. And I was like there's a better way to do this. And in fact, the more money I make, the more money I end up with, the more good I could do. So let's just do that. Let's make a lot of money.
Melinda Wittstock: There's that shift, and it's interesting when people talk about giving back and I think, well actually, it's giving forward because the more money that we actually have, if we're conscious and mission focused, the more leverage we have to do good in the world.
Trudi Lebron: Absolutely.
Melinda Wittstock: And so there's nothing bad about making money. I think there's a lot of women who, I don't know, for some reason had that kind of idea that, “Oh my God, I'm taking away from somebody.”
Trudi Lebron: Absolutely. And I get that phone call all the time. I get clients who call me or potential clients who call me and they get on the phone and say, “Trudi, I want to start a nonprofit.” And I go like, “Really? I don't know.”
Melinda Wittstock: You say, “No, no, no, don't do that.”
Trudi Lebron: And I ask a couple of questions and I've had hundreds of calls with clients and potential clients, and it's a rare phone call where I ended up with, “Actually, this doesn't need to be a nonprofit.” Every once in a while someone's idea is better suited for that. But usually you don't have to. It's usually fear driving that decision like fear of sales, fear of being like a business owner and kind of taking that responsibility of generating your own income. Even though in a nonprofit you still have to do that but it just doesn't feel the same because you think that the money is coming from somewhere else. It's not any more secure. Neither of them are more secure.
Melinda Wittstock: Yeah. I remember sweating it out writing these grant applications. And then what would happen is you would torque your business or nonprofit further and further and further away from its core purpose because you'd have to go with what the foundations thought were like trendy or whatever. And then they'd fund you for like a year or maybe three if you were lucky. And then after that, the whole area, that whole program of your nonprofit would just like end, and meantime nobody funded operational costs.
Trudi Lebron: Exactly. Exactly. And so your job as a founder goes from… Usually founders are people who are really motivated to solve problems and they want to work on the ground, and they want to be in the communities. And what happens is the vast majority of your time actually goes into finding money to run the operations and to run the programs, and you don't get to actually spend a lot of time solving the problems that you want to solve.
Melinda Wittstock: Oh my goodness. I know. Exactly. And this is why I think we have so much more leverage and power as a for-profit. Obviously, there are different ways of organizing our B corps and things like that. But even if you're just a regular LLC or a C Corp or an S Corp, but whatever, however you're organized, it doesn't really matter. I think there's a tremendous scope now to innovate business models, whether it's something like Toms shoes, like a buy one give one or whether like us, you take some of your top line revenue and put it to micro loans supporting women, say women owned businesses in the developing world or there's so many different things you can do or you make your business carbon neutral or like, I don't know, clean supply chain, diversity of your team. That is so huge. Just the other day, and this is interesting, Goldman Sachs announced that they would not be handling anyone's IPO anymore unless they have women on the board. So it's shifting.
Trudi Lebron: Yeah. It's just about time.
Melinda Wittstock: It's shifting. What's interesting is it's shifting at that level and what that tells me is that the numbers add up that these companies are driving higher valuations, more revenue, more customer loyalty, better teams, and all of that for having that mission. There's actually not only doing good in the world, but there's profit in it.
Trudi Lebron: Yes, there's a major profit and also major sustainability. So you're absolutely right. In order for companies to be making those policy-based decisions, right? This is how we should behave and this is like our culture. This is a policy decision. And in order for that to happen, there has to be evidence that there's an impact on the bottom line. And so absolutely. Not only are our folks more likely to generate more revenue, but their outcomes are better.
Trudi Lebron: The way that they deliver their services tends to be better. The solutions that they come up with are more dynamic and more resilient. There's just so many benefits to treating your business this way and to really investing in your impact like different leavers of impact. You don't always see the benefit tomorrow. This is a long-term strategy, but hopefully you're in business for the long term.
Melinda Wittstock: So when you're working with all these high powered executives that are your clients and entrepreneurs, do you specifically advise them on social impact models?
Trudi Lebron: Yes. So that's why people come to me. People come to me because they are realizing that they need to address social impact, especially things like diversity, equity and inclusion in their businesses. Or they are entrepreneurs like maybe younger entrepreneurs, and I don't mean age younger, just earlier in their entrepreneurial journey and they're coming from backgrounds that are maybe from the nonprofit industry or activists or social workers. And so they have that heart that they want to build it this way from the beginning.
Trudi Lebron: And so that's what we look at. We look at what are the different ways for you to be making an impact? What are the different ways for you to be a leader that is just, and that can stand for the values that the company represents or infusing your values into the way that you do business. So that's what we do and it's super fulfilling and exciting work.
Melinda Wittstock: That's amazing. Can you give us some examples of some of the things that you've been able to do with either in an instance where there's a company that exists already and wants to add something like this into their company or a founder. What are some of the things that some of the impacts and things that you've seen or helps people achieve?
Trudi Lebron: Sure. So right now I'm working on a very exciting initiative. It's several initiatives, but the one that's coming to mind right in the moment is with Hay House Publishing. And Hay House reached out because they were confronting the fact that they weren't being as inclusive and diverse as their values said they should be. They were realizing there was a disconnect. And I've been working with them for almost a year now and we've done a complete kind of audit of their company.
Trudi Lebron: We've talked to authors, we've talked to readers, we've talked to staff to really look for different ways that they can leverage what they had, understand what was missing and what they decided. One of the things that we decided to do was to expand a program called diverse wisdom and that was a program that they had launched very small in the UK and the idea was to bring in new authors of color. And over the last year we've been able to expand that to the United States.
Trudi Lebron: We had over 50 people apply. We're actually getting ready for a second application of that program and we're expecting way more folks to apply because of the success of their program. And the folks who were accepted in that initiative are getting coaching from Hay House authors to do a book proposal. One of the people in that program will get a book publishing contract with them and all of the people who are going through that program will have a polished book proposal that they can then either self-publish or bring to different agents.
Trudi Lebron: And so that is something that has… And that has massive impact because what is now happening is because we're doing this work, we're noticing that the conferences that they have are just naturally more diverse. The way that the company is talking and thinking about things like marketing is starting to shift. There has been a complete shift of the culture internally around this conversation and now we're looking at “Okay, how do we bring this to the next level?”
Melinda Wittstock: So this is really interesting and that's awesome that you're doing that. I mean I think almost every company, there's so many companies that need what you do. And I think a lot of founders, particularly at the early stages of a company, I mean they attract people like them. Right?
Trudi Lebron: Sure. Right.
Melinda Wittstock: And that's just invariable because your social circle or whatever or the people that you know. And so what are some of the early steps, the first steps you can do? Because you set this intention that… I mean I'm just launching my fifth business right now and I want it to be really inclusive and really diverse. And I'm a white girl, right? And it's tricky because when your initial team is all kind of vanilla and you need to attract others, other people look at it and say, “Oh, that's just a bunch of white people. So now I'm not interested.”
Melinda Wittstock: And so how do you get over that piece? What are the first things to do? And I'm asking… So I think a lot of people are talking about this saying, “God, I wish I had more women of color coming to my retreat or I wish I had…” And a wish isn't good enough. So how can we put that into actual action that delivers results on that?
Trudi Lebron: So one of the first things I advise people to do is to get some support, and coaching around unpacking and just owning what it means to be white and part of that system. And that is something that is very scary for people because they make it mean a whole lot of things about like, “Oh, am I a racist? Is this bad? This is so uncomfortable.” Yes, it is uncomfortable, but it's essential. I often make the connection to money mindset training and money mindset training is something that is in the coaching industry. Most people have done some kind of [crosstalk [spp-timestamp time="00:35:24"].
Melinda Wittstock: You have to. You can't be an entrepreneur without hitting that at some point because we all have these money issues like, “Oh my God, I spent a lot of time and money in coaching and God knows how many meditation sessions to get rid of my money issues.”
Trudi Lebron: Exactly. So this is the perfect kind of analogy for the kind of work that I do. So when someone signs up to do money mindset work and invest in money mindset work and you know we invest time. We invest not just money, but it's also time and energy, and focus, all these things. So when someone does that, the general agreement is that people grew up in homes and in communities where they kind of absorbed these subconscious ideas about money. About money being good about money being bad, about how it should be used.
Trudi Lebron: So this is like really deep subconscious stuff that happens without you don't know what's happening. It's not that anyone sat down and explicitly taught you to be this way, it's just at that subconscious level and you have absorbed it from all these messages around you based on where you grew up and what you've encountered. And so that's the general agreement. And so people do money mindset work to basically surface those subconscious thoughts about money and replace them with better patterns and to build new habits, right?
Melinda Wittstock: Mm-hmm (affirmative).
Trudi Lebron: If you agree with that…
Melinda Wittstock: Oh, yeah. I totally get where you're going here. [crosstalk [spp-timestamp time="00:37:01"] these subconscious issues around race, right?
Trudi Lebron: Exactly.
Melinda Wittstock: And there's all kinds of guilt and all kinds of shame and all kinds of like, “God, how am I supposed to eat all of that stuff?”
Trudi Lebron: Right.
Melinda Wittstock: I can only imagine.
Trudi Lebron: This is exactly it. All of us have grown up in a society that have privileged some people and disadvantaged other people, oppressed other people. We picked up messages about that at both explicit and conscious, and also subconscious levels. And it influences the way that we behave, the way that we show up, the way that we interact with people. And we may or may not know that it's even happening.
Melinda Wittstock: It's true. It's one of these iceberg things like we don't even know what we don't know.
Trudi Lebron: Right. And so we think that we have done work because we're like, “Oh.” I have friends who are like all colors or I studied this in high school. We think that we've done some surface work and so we're all set until you come up against that moment, just like with money stuff where things kind of go haywire and you're like, “Oh, actually there's more going on here than I thought.”
Melinda Wittstock: Absolutely.
Trudi Lebron: So the first step is to unpack those subconscious thoughts. I mean, I do this kind of work, but there's also other people that you can find to help you unpack whiteness and unpack your identity. Even folks of color can do this kind of work. Unpack your identity. Unpack those stories, those subconscious stories that you're holding on to and replace them with new thoughts and new patterns and new skills so that when you do bring in or call in a more diverse audience, you are prepared to hold that space.
Trudi Lebron: You can't just assume that you're ready to do that. That's first step. And once you do that, the onion unfolds, and you're like, “Oh, okay. Now, I'm on this path, and other opportunities to learn and grow and to show up as what we call an accomplice present themselves.” But the first place is to just like acknowledge where you are and start unpacking that identity.
Melinda Wittstock: Absolutely. Okay, so that's step one and you start doing that. And then what are some other things. I remember Angela Lauria from the Author Incubator on this podcast not so long ago, just puts Black Lives Matter on every page of her website. at the end of the day you just have to own it. You sort of know who you are.
Trudi Lebron: Right . And that's the thing like I don't advise people to just start doing that just because. Because if you're not ready, if you just do it as a symbol without really-
Melinda Wittstock: And then it doesn't mean anything. Yeah.
Trudi Lebron: Right. Then it doesn't mean anything, and then when someone calls you out on it, you're not ready to hold it. You know what I mean? [crosstalk [spp-timestamp time="00:39:59"]
Melinda Wittstock: Right. And so she is, because she's done that.
Trudi Lebron: Absolutely. Yeah.
Melinda Wittstock: She's done that work. And so people are at different stages of this. But it reminds me of when Kentucky Fried Chicken was trying to look evolved and they put a pink ribbon for breast cancer on their bucket of carcinogens. So there was like a total misalignment. Right?
Trudi Lebron: Exactly. You do that work of that unpacking and that looking at your brand, and that's where the coaching piece is. That's the kind of the work that I do with people. It's like, “All right. Now, let's look at your business. Let's look at your values. Let's make sure there's alignment, and then we can start looking at things like marketing, outreach, partnership building.” But you have to do that alignment work first.
Melinda Wittstock: That makes total sense. Like any change, it always starts within.
Trudi Lebron: Absolutely.
Melinda Wittstock: Yeah. This is amazing. So Trudi, let's go back in time a little bit because I did promise that I would ask you about what it was like. So there you are, you're 16 years old and you have two kids at 16.
Trudi Lebron: Yeah.
Melinda Wittstock: Wow.
Trudi Lebron: It was interesting. That's for sure.
Melinda Wittstock: I bet. I mean, that's just really hard. I mean I think back to what I was doing at 16 and I was a pretty responsible girl. I had a couple jobs. I did stuff like that, but it's so hard to imagine the impact on your life and all the things that you can't do, and all of that. Take me back there. So what was going on in your mind and what you thought it meant for the rest of your life and all of that?
Trudi Lebron: Yeah. Well, I will say that the same kind of personality traits that got me in a lot of trouble when I was a kid were these exact personality traits that I needed. [inaudible [spp-timestamp time="00:42:01"]
Melinda Wittstock: Oh God. I'm laughing really hard because I remember I was at an entrepreneurial mastermind and a speaker had us do all this, “Put your hand up if your right-handed and if your left-handed.” And he went through all these things that were really easy. And then it got to the point where it was like, “How many of you have been in jail?” And there was like a huge number of entrepreneurs that had been arrested.
Trudi Lebron: That's so funny.
Melinda Wittstock: Right? Because it's that same thing like the rebelliousness of all that thinking for yourself or doing things differently or whatever is actually like a really good thing in entrepreneurship, but it's not necessarily terrific when we're kids.
Trudi Lebron: Right. So I was super stubborn and I didn't listen to authority and I didn't want to follow any rules and I questioned absolutely everything. I didn't make for the easiest child to raise, I'm sure. However, when I was 16, I had my oldest son when I was 15 years old and then I had a second son when I was 16 and so I'm 16 years old, these two babies and I dropped out of high school and everyone with the exception of a handful of people and in most of the world around me telling me that I had failed, that I would never amount to anything, that I was going to be poor for the rest of my life, that the outcomes for my children were going to be really negative and that everything was going to be a fight for the rest of my life.
Trudi Lebron: I was stubborn about that. I was like, “Nope, you watch and see. I am going to solve this. Everything is going to be fine in the long run.” And so I just took that responsibility on as a reason to just work really hard and buckle down and be focused. So I didn't do a lot of the things that lot of kids did. I was really focused. I homeschooled myself through high school. I became a college senior a year early when the rest of my graduating class or what would have been my graduating class where high school seniors, I was a college freshman.
Trudi Lebron: I just got super focused on I have to be successful. I refuse to struggle for the rest of my life and I'm going to change this narrative. And that's what I did. It wasn't easy, but that's what I did.
Melinda Wittstock: when I hear a story like that and then I hear people complain who don't have anywhere near the challenge that you had. Right? And complain about how hard it is for them or if only someone could do something else or just waiting, waiting, waiting for somebody else to do something for them. Like waiting for prince charming or like waiting for the [inaudible [spp-timestamp time="00:45:02"]. Not actually having the… I don't know, just that inner fire to take responsibility for themselves.
Trudi Lebron: Yeah, I think that the idea of taking responsibility and just deciding that you're going to do something and setting out to accomplish that is a tremendous skill and that not everybody has, I'll also say that I had a lot of… There was some luck involved in where I was able to end up getting to, and a certain degree of privilege. I was never homeless. I didn't have any learning disabilities. My parents were financially stable. We weren't rich. We were working class people.
Trudi Lebron: My parents were divorced. We had challenges, but I wasn't ever hungry. You know what I mean? I had a certain amount of stability that allowed me to get there. But you're right. When clients come to me and say all the reasons that they can't do X, Y, Z, I'm not the easiest person to convince that, that something is impossible because I'm like, “Let's figure out a way to get it done.”
Melinda Wittstock: Well, isn't it true that anything is possible? I mean, what we can conceive, you were talking about money mindset a moment ago, but like what we can conceive, we can achieve. And when you start to realize that the thoughts that we have really dictate our future. And then those subconscious ones though are awkward because we don't necessarily know what's driving us.
Trudi Lebron: Right. That's true. That's absolutely true. That's why we get help and invest in coaching or go to school or go to therapy. Even those things are choices. We can choose to say, “I'm stuck here and I'm going to figure out a way to get unstuck. And so I'm going to go and get the help that I need.” That's a choice. But it's also a choice to say I'm going to throw my hands off and just like, “There's nothing I can do.” Those are both choices.
Melinda Wittstock: Oh yes, they are. Absolutely. So when you look at this new decade and all the impacts that you can visualize ahead for yourself, what is kind of lighting you up right now about the impact that you're going to have on the world? In the decade ahead?
Trudi Lebron: Yeah. I'm just really excited about the future. The work that I'm doing with my clients, both kind of more corporate clients in the coaching industry to help them make their brands super aligned and values driven and include… These vibrant, inclusive communities that has really global impact. Working with brands who are big personal development brands like Hay House for example, and some of the authors in Hay House that I have the privilege of working with and supporting, they have global reach. And so like when I get to work with them that has like ripple effects in their businesses and in the world, then the clients that come and work with me to help build mission-driven, impact-driven businesses, I get to watch their… I just get to watch them develop into these really integrous entrepreneurs who feel good about what they're doing, who are earning more money, who are following their dreams.
Trudi Lebron: It just lights me up to see them really killing it in their businesses. And then also I want to do things like… The reason that I have dreams to make millions and millions of dollars is because I want to open a school. I want to contribute to people who are building really world changing and culture changing businesses and ideas. This year, right now we've committed to doing some investment of my time in the local community like advising on the development of some initiatives that are designed to help students do better in school and to bring more personal development into the education system in my local community.
Trudi Lebron: And that is like really, really impactful. Right now we are starting the fourth year of a program that I designed called Be A Boss and Be A Boss is a year long program for women of color who are mostly in the nonprofit industry. They're nonprofit professionals who are looking to start businesses and side hustles and to make the kind of transition that I made out of the nonprofit industry into the entrepreneurial world. I want to be able to help them navigate that a little bit easier than it was for me when I was trying to figure it out, and I didn't think I could make any money. Like I really want to work for them.
Melinda Wittstock: I love it.
Trudi Lebron: So we're starting our fourth year of that program where I'm based in Hartford, Connecticut. And I want that program to grow. So there's just so much that I am looking… I'm looking forward also to growing my team. We hired our first employees at the end of last year. So it's very exciting and I'm always thinking about how do we grow responsibly and how do we improve the lives of the people that we care about the most? How do we make that balance? Those are exciting inquiries to be sitting in.
Melinda Wittstock: I love it. I mean, I really think that when women get together and collaborate as well, when we kind of use the hashtag lift as we climb, when we come at it from abundance and we're really there for each other and help each other with all these things, miracles happen as well. I just think what you're doing is amazing. It's very inspirational and really needed.
Trudi Lebron: Thank you.
Melinda Wittstock: Needed, needed, needed. So I have no doubt you're just going to soar off like some media or whatever. So Trudi, how can people find you and work with you? I know there's a lot of people listening to this podcast who really do need the services you're providing and so what's the best way they can get in touch with you?
Trudi Lebron: So the best way to get in touch with me is probably on Instagram. Follow me at Trudi Lebron, T-R-U-D-I L-E-B-R-O-N. I'm getting more active over there most days. You can also find me on Facebook and hang out in my Facebook group. And there's a couple of ways that I work with people. I do a couple of intensives with people like day long things, but I also have some longer programs that people can participate in. I'm all about helping people find… Meet them where they are and getting them the right kind of support that they need. So come and hang out with me online and start following along, and we'll find out what you need and we'll get you that.
Melinda Wittstock: That's fantastic. And meantime you also have a video people can watch as well. Tell everybody about that.
Trudi Lebron: Yes. We have a five-day video series. It's called Business is More Than. And that's all about how doing impact driven business is more than just about profit or list size or marketing, but it's about different qualities like impact for example, and community building, and values. And so it's just a different way to look at your business and to start approaching some of these questions like how do we do business and do good business and make money, but also change the world at the same time.
Melinda Wittstock: Oh. Amen. How wonderful. Thank you so much, Trudi for putting on your wings and flying with us.
Trudi Lebron: You're so welcome. Thank you for having me.