221 Debbi Dachinger: Dare to Dream

Debbi Dachinger is a visibility expert who helps her clients dare to dream bigger.  So much of entrepreneurial success necessitates getting exposure to boost your influence and impact – and that means bestselling books, media appearances and keynote speeches. Debbi, host of the syndicated radio show Dare To Dream, shares the inside skinny on how to get on stages and TV.

Melinda Wittstock:         Debbi, welcome to Wings.

Debbi Dachinger:             Thank you Melinda. Great to be here.

Melinda Wittstock:         It's great to have you on, too. I want to start by really with the theme of Dare To Dream, which is the name of your podcast. And I love it when women, really all of us, really can think big. You know really, this idea of daring to kind of step into our true passion and purpose and I know you help so many people do that. What was the spark that made you want to dare to dream?

Debbi Dachinger:             I think I always wanted to dream and I always wanted to create dreams, Melinda. And I think I was super hit and miss. I live a life where sometimes amazing thing would happen and sometimes what I really desired just wasn't manifesting. And it culminated the big pivot point for me was a break-up. They are such a great catalyst, aren't they?

Melinda Wittstock:         Oh my goodness, yes.

Debbi Dachinger:             And it can be the most amazing motivator and I moved out of the situation. I was living with my boyfriend at the time. I moved into my own apartment. And I was sitting there all lonely, wah, wah on the floor. I was the one who broke up but still I was reassessing my life and I thought back, how interesting. You know the previous three and a half years I noticed, I had been really revolving my life around a man's life and he never asked me to do it. I did it and I gave up a lot of things I would've like to have done. And that did not set very well with me.

So the next thing that made sense was, “Well, why don't we write a list and just see what's inside of me? What would I do if I could do it, even if I think it's impossible to do.” So I had this really beautiful list, about 10 pretty big time things to go after and then I thought, “Well that's cool. Now what do we do?” And I learned a system. I decided to reverse engineer, start where I was, to know what the dream was, work backwards with the steps and what would happen if I took the steps? And I started to live out loud, one after another, very, very different dreams coming true.

And I felt well, “If I'm able to do that for travel and white water rafting and shooting a gun and doing an LA marathon, and getting up and singing and changing my body.” I mean there were just huge things on that list. If I'm able to do this, what is possible if I help other people?

So I actually started talking all over Los Angeles and I was doing a workshop. I wanted to teach people because I was so on fire about this. And then fortunately for me I was an actress, a singer, I was doing cartoon work for voice-overs. I saw an ad for radio. I was given the job. I thought, “Oh well, I'll do this. It will get my voice-over voice out there even more,” and of course the universe had something totally different in mind for me.

It really wasn't about that. I was meant to be working in that area and in that arena. And when I had the opportunity and they said, “We like the work you're doing the past couple of months. We're ready to give you your own show.” It was just a download and it seemed a natural progression, Dare To Dream. I want a show people, “You can do this too. And here is how and don't just take my word.” Let me bring on people whose names you might know and whose creations you might know, but it was backstory you might not know about what they superseded or how they got where they are.

And that's how Dare To Dream was born. It was that big pivot point of, “Ah, all of what I've given up and haven't done and this huge being on fire, I'm going to do this. I'm going to make all of this happen,” and then I still use it today when I want to create things.

Melinda Wittstock:         How inspiring. It's so interesting that I think when we look back at our lives and we get old enough to realize that in a way we're really just alchemists. We have these things that happen to us that are painful. You know maybe we're just out of alignment with who we truly are, or there's something that we're recovering from, perhaps something from our childhood and but there's opportunity in those things. And if we can just be quiet for a moment and let go of the thing that's making us unhappy, let go of whatever that is, and literally just dare to step into something new, just being open, open to like a different way of going.

That's where so many really amazing innovations happen. That's when people find their purpose, their passion, their alignment, everything.

Debbi Dachinger:             Yeah for most of us I think, Melinda, that life can be Ground Hog Day.

Melinda Wittstock:         Yes. Absolutely. Well, it's interesting actually in this whole coaching area where there can be people who can go to coaches and spend a fortune on coaches and learn a huge amount, right? There are other people who can do the same and learn nothing. And still other people who are convinced they have to do it all by themselves. And I always find it amusing that the people who want to do it all by themselves want to be somewhere different, right? But they think they can get there by themselves and if they could, right, they would already be there.

So we all need help sometimes in really being able to see this. Sometimes it's an epiphany that happens when were on our own but more often than not, it's when we get out of our comfort zone enough to admit our vulnerability and ask for help.

Debbi Dachinger:             Right. I'm so guilty by the way of what you're talking about because I'm a total nerd. I love to research things. I don't know why I get off on it, but I really do. It's really interesting sometimes for me to understand things or have a better comprehension. And so because of that, I often will learn in a street-sense how to do something. And one of the things I've had to re-learn or re-teach myself is we're all coachable. I'm a coach, I also need a coach.

Melinda Wittstock:         We all do.

Debbi Dachinger:             Right.

Melinda Wittstock:         We all do. Oh my goodness. I was the same like I really had this kind of rugged thing like I've got this. I can do this. And it served me for a while, you know like until it didn't. If I don't surround myself with like really supportive, like a supportive ecosystem, mentors, you know there's different coaches for different times in your life and for different times in your life and for different things. When I started to do that and really invest in that, or invest in coaching or mentors or whatever, everything changed for me. Things became easier. I could spot things, or rather they could spot things that I could not spot about myself.

Debbi Dachinger:             Yeah, it's so true. I think the gentle push into where we're meant to be, you know, often a coach can see our brilliance and help guide us. I know, like I'm in a one year program right now. I'm doing a couple of things with coaches. I'm loving it. I'm loving that I can sit back and rest and light up a cigar and somebody else is helping me and showing me things. Because I'm a coach I know enough when a coach tells me to do something my answer is yes. Yes and. You want me to write that? Sure. You want me to read that? Sure. You want me to show up and push myself? Whatever you want.

One of my coaches right now has said, “You should be on stages all the time speaking.” I'm so lazy, Melinda, I have been the person like invite me I'll come. That's been my story for like seven years. I've spoken on stages all over the United States but generally, somebody has asked me. Even in Canada, right? My coach is saying, “No, now we're going to build a practice where you're going after mindfully because you belong on these really big stages.” Naturally, the moment I said, “Yeah,” resistance, uncomfortable but yeah, I'm going to do it. I believe you. I know that's where I'm meant to play.

So many doors have opened that I didn't even try to knock on that have come to me, a connection and people who want to collaborate and have me come meet their people on their stages. Wonderful opportunities just because I invested in myself. I said yes to the exercises and yes to going where it's not comfortable.

Melinda Wittstock:         Mm-hmm (affirmative), well that latter point, going where it's not comfortable. Let's talk a little bit about that. By the way, I do agree, you are meant to be on stage as you have a magnetic way about you. Debbi and I were both icons of influence. Isn't that lovely? Icons of influence at the New Media Summit just recently. You know, I got a glimpse of you, not as much as I would have liked, but you do. You have a wonderful stage presence and you have a great way about you. Yes, you go girl. You go do that.

Debbi Dachinger:             Thank you. That's so encouraging. See?

Melinda Wittstock:         Well, see, here's the funny thing. When people put their intentions out into the universe and say what they really want and what they really need, people will show up to help you. But if you don't tell anybody, no one is going to help you. I remember I had a sales coach, once, who just told me to go out and get as many no's as possible. I think I was afraid of the no, you know? A big enterprise software, sort of long lead time sales, right? Which it was really, really hard because there's so many dynamics, and so many decision makers. Like oh my God, painful. He told me to go and get as many no's as possible, which was awesome. It sort of liberated me because I had to go out and by getting the no, I had to be actually asking. It's amazing how many people in like a sales scenario, much less a learning scenario, don't ask or are afraid to ask.

Debbi Dachinger:             Yes. I'm so all about that, actually. What I know about myself is I'm never going to burden somebody for sure. I mean, I would do the opposite and I also have enough sensitivity, I think most of us do, that you know, it's okay to ask this but you can't keep going back, right? I mean there has to be something else happening in that relationship. Because I really just think it's so important to show up. I've done so many calls, even before you and I met today, with some people I consider to be prominent and I made sure in our conversation, what can I do for you? What are you looking for? Who might I refer to you? What would rock your world? What challenges do you have that I might have a solution or a direction or just listen today? It was my joy to allow them to be transparent and let them make an ask, right? See if I can help them in some way. I just know it's like, it's sort of like banking, you know? You're just sort of creating this investment. You've got something going on and a comfort zone with somebody.

I love the ask. I'm not that afraid anymore to do it. Interestingly enough, because even asking for … Somebody said, I don't remember where it was but there was a posting and I think it was in our group where somebody said, “What are you looking for?” I said, “I'm looking for a speaking gig.” This gal on her own private messaged me and said, “I'm introducing you to somebody.” She introduced me to an event coordinator. It was hilarious because I totally know this person. I never even considered oh yeah, [crosstalk [spp-timestamp time="00:26:00"], right? We're re-meeting, we already know each other, we had a great laugh and then we got on the phone and she's like, “I've got this, I've got that, I've got this,” all these things available and she knows me. It's very easy for me when I say, “Yes,” that she feels comfortable presenting me.

Again, it's about the ask and it's about going into the comfort, discomfort, and the discomfort is going to become comfortable anyway, you just do something enough and it's okay.

Melinda Wittstock:         Well, magic often happens in those moments when we're not comfortable. Often what it means is that we're growing. When you think of anything where you're moving on to something, you're getting a new skill. You have to be willing to fail to learn, right? There's a great book by Daniel Coyle called The Talent Code and he talks about real, either prodigies or just like people who are like at the top of their profession whatever it is. What they have in common is that they're willing to go to the extremes, like the outer edges are just beyond their capability consistently. In essence, they're failing all the time but they're learning from their failure. As they're doing that, they're actually creating something in their brain called Mylar. You can think of Mylar as kind of like the scaffolding of your brain, like the thing that makes you much more efficient as a learner. The more Mylar you create by kind of being right at the edge of your comfort zone, right? The easier it is to learn the next thing, and the next thing, and the next thing.

I don't know, as an entrepreneur I'm a constant learner, like you can't not be because things around you are changing so quickly and opportunities are presenting and things are just, you know, you're constantly kind of in that slight discomfort, hopefully, because you're growing. It's just learning to embrace that. That's one way of thinking about why it's okay to be uncomfortable.

Debbi Dachinger:             Yeah, I love the Science behind what we actually do when we expand like that. Mylar. I'm going to remember that.

Melinda Wittstock:         Yeah, it's a great book. The Talent Code. Really, really interesting. It's an easy read, you know, quite short and very compelling. You know, Daniel Coyle studies entrepreneurs and studies really high performers whether they're athletes or artists. Everybody who does extraordinary things has this in common. When we start anything, like I find myself tell my kids this. When you start anything you're not going to be good at it right away, it's impossible.

Debbi Dachinger:             Right, absolutely. Most of what we tell ourselves is BS anyway. I mean the stuff between our heads can just be the worst neighborhood to live in.

Melinda Wittstock:         Oh my God, oh, now this is interesting. Do you find this? You know that like inner voice, that little negative self-talk person, right? I mean, do you catch yourself? This happens to me sometimes where my negative Melinda is talking to me in a way that I wouldn't tolerate from my worst enemy.

Debbi Dachinger:             You know, I think it's very interesting the story that I hear sometimes which is what I can and can't do as though it knows this. In fact, it really is BS. You know, when I had it in my belly that I wanted to do a marathon I mean, that was really unthinkable. Come on, 22.6 miles. Who was I to think I could possibly do that? I was kind of an athlete but I wasn't like that athlete. You know, it just, again, was that reverse engineering. Here I am, totally never going to happen. There I am, there's my dream going to a finish line after 26.2 miles. I made the phone call, right? I made the ask. I called the marathon office because I didn't know where else to start. They said, “We have trainings.” Oh, who knew? Great!

For eight months here's what you do and they gave me the list and I followed the recipe. Of course, eight months later what happened, right? You know, whereas I started out thinking this is impossible. This is a great dream, but never going to happen. Once I crossed that finish line I knew I could do this over and over again if I chose to and I did. I did it more than one time. Just changed the goal, of course, at the end. It is BS what we tell ourselves. It is a story. We don't really know the real story and I truly believe that sometimes it's incumbent on us to put ourselves in the path of that fire in our belly, of that inspiration to create the dream. If we have the desire to create the dream, we have the capability to make it come true. Guess what? If it doesn't come true, I really believe we are on that path for a reason because something else is meant to come up in our space to do and it can't come up if we're not on the path toward that thing.

No matter what, I think it's good and good. The result is always going to be a really great result.

Melinda Wittstock:         Oh gosh, you know, this is so, so true. Debbi, take me back in time a little bit. What were you like as a little girl? Did you know that you were going to go out and do all the things that you're doing? I mean, did you know kind of what you wanted in your life? Who you wanted to be?

Debbi Dachinger:             Ish. I did. You know, when I was a very little girl, Melinda, the only thing I cared about was acting and singing and certainly that's what I went out in the world and did for a majority of my life. There was that I think I was interesting and I think a lot of how I was then is sort of reversed because I was shy. I was actually, also, there were parts of me that were outgoing. There were parts of me that were big. Especially when I did anything on stage and I was acting from the time I was really little. That was a wonderful outlet for me because I sort of had this awkwardness, shyness about me. I knew always what I wanted to do. Everybody in high school knew what I was going to do and be. I went to USC and performing arts. I went out in the world after that, I was a performer. I just followed something that was 100% natural progression.

The big surprise is where I ended up now because I couldn't have ever predicted that I'd be working in the genre, the venues that I am and that I'd be coaching in them. I would say the groundwork was set for me as a child to be and do what I've been doing. Right? To be in entertainment; to be in communication; to be understanding people's hearts and voices. Some of that, obviously, came from painful experiences that I decided would never happen to anybody else on my watch, as well as places where I was really blessed to be nurtured and where I saw great examples in my family of being on stage and speaking. That was my Grandfather. He was a great inventor and he spoke all over the world. I have a lot of him inside of me. I'm an amalgam of all of what I grew up with.

Melinda Wittstock:         There are so many clues, I think, to who we ultimately become or what our true passion and purpose is in our childhood. I tell a story every now and again about the entrepreneur in me. I don't know what it was that made me go do this, but when I was five, almost six, I went knocking door-to-door with my black Labrador demanding that people prepay for my show. Not just pay, but prepay. Who knows, right? That's just so funny to me. I'm not really sure, you know, maybe I heard my parents saying like we didn't have enough money or something. I have no idea, right? It's like let me take this on. I'm going to solve this problem right now.

Debbi Dachinger:             That's so adorable. Oh my God! [inaudible [spp-timestamp time="00:34:40"] that we had, right? You weren't afraid of the ask back then.

Melinda Wittstock:         No, exactly. This is the funny thing is as kids we're not. You know, if you think back to, if you observe any child they are the most tenacious negotiators. They will be, they will never give up asking for what it is they want. Then somehow, over time like I don't know, that gets sort of beaten out of them in a way, right? We all have that. We all have that tenacity, or that kind of purity of like I want this. Then somehow we learn all these things that kind of like stop us from asking for what we want.

Debbi Dachinger:             Oh my God, so you remind me of a story when you say that, Melinda, that when I was a young girl, I'm trying to think around what age ish, but I'm thinking I was around somewhere between 10-12 years old. My best friend, Lea, and I auditioned for a play that was taking place in New York called Gypsy. We both auditioned for the lead part. She got it. She got Louise who grows up to be the stripper Gypsy. I got the chorus part, which is unthinkable, right? I do not belong in the chorus. I knew that back then. We'd show up at rehearsals and I had to bite it all the time, like just ah, sing my song and get off the stage. Oh, I wanted the microphone, I wanted the spotlight. Well, one week Lea was sick, she had a cold or the flu or something and she couldn't come to rehearsal. Then everyday that entire week she was out sick.

I couldn't take it anymore, so I went up to the producer, I went up to the director and I said, as a little girl, I said, “Hi, I know Lea is out sick and I just want you to know that I know all the songs, I know all the lines and I know all the dance moves and I could fill in right now.” They gave me the part. They gave me the part. Lea came back, and God bless her to this day, never said a word because I think to her it was like whatever. I don't think it was such a big deal, but for me it was everything. I got to go on stage and be Louise because talk about the big ask. I took such advantage of that situation without a black Labrador, by the way. I just went up myself and made sure they knew that I could handle it. They watched me in that rehearsal do everything I said I could and boom. That was it. I was Louise. I went on to do the role and all the performances. I loved every second.

Melinda Wittstock:         dMy goodness, you know. It's interesting. You don't know until you ask. I love that you just stood up and advocated for yourself. This is something that I think women sometimes struggle with because I think we're afraid of looking too pushy or God, the dreaded B word, or too aggressive or whatever. I mean, is there a way that women have to do this that's different from men? I mean, because I think there's this fear, specifically for women, we're so afraid of being kind of cast out of the tribe or just looking too pushy or something.

Debbi Dachinger:             Oh sure. I know this is true. I really do, and I think even women perpetuate that against women. In certain rooms and situations we look at a man and say, “Oh, that's confident. That's savvy.” We look at a woman like oh that, you know, fill in the word. It's not a kind word because we are used to a woman not displaying that and they should, instead, be in column A. When in fact, it actually can be really, really inspiring and, I think when you ask that question I also think there's an energetic fine line. I think we're very sensitive to somebody's energy, and when we as women, I'll just use myself as an example to own it. When I go after something, if I do it with a real confidence and a real detachment in a way, but a real wanting, a real desire for that outcome, I think that's great and it probably has a really good opportunity to be received.

I think when there's an aggressiveness behind it, it is unattractive whether it's a man or a woman and we can all feel that. That desperate kind of shouldering our way in. That's not great. I don't think we want to lead with that energy. I just want to make that distinction that yes, I do think that there are different ways that we treat a man and a woman, period. I think for men and women, it's really good when we have an energetic difference between pushing our way into something or presenting ourselves as being credibly capable and desiring it.

Melinda Wittstock:         Mm-hmm (affirmative), oh yeah. This is so true. I think women right know, we have this amazing opportunity to step into what I would call our authentic feminine power. And where men tend to be a lot more archetypically kind of linear, and in pursuit, right? I'm going to go spear the wildebeest and carry it back on my back. Women, on the other hand are more about the relationship and attracting things. This again, it's just really, you mentioned energy. So this kind of a different type of energy. So how we go about the sale potentially is different.

I'm just of the age right now where all my role models were male coming up. I spent most of my life as the only woman in the room. So I didn't really have a lot of female role models. So I didn't really know anything about feminine energy for years. And I ended up sort of being a dude in a skirt almost, right? I laugh at myself; it kind of worked for me for a while, but at some sacrifice. You burn out doing that, and it doesn't feel right. So now everything's sort of flipped around, I have such a different approach.

Debbi Dachinger:             And what is that approach?

Melinda Wittstock:         Well it's much more about ‘being’ and less about ‘doing’. For me anyway, very much more it's been inspired really by a spiritual journey I guess. What's interesting is I ended up in the Amazon Rainforest two and a bit years ago. And I remember having this epiphany as I sat there in the middle of nowhere, really. Like Google hasn't charted that, there's no one to call. Literally in the middle of the Amazon Rainforest with all the jaguar and the poisonous frogs and all of that, it was the most peaceful thing possible. And thinking to myself wow, this is really balanced the energies, the kind of yin and yang, the masculine feminine. Everything is this wonderful ecosystem that makes the other look better for the contrast, if you will. And I remember thinking to myself, “Wow, I think the really highly evolved people are the people who balance these kind of archetypal masculine and feminine kind of within.”

So long story, and it is a long story, long story short, I started changing. Instead of doing task lists, I now do intentions. So in the morning I will meditate and I will think of what will make today great? What do I want the result to be at the end of the day? At the end of the week? At the end of the month, at the end of the year, what's that result? And I will visualize it, and meditate on it, and feel it, and feel gratitude for it as if it's already happened. And I've gotten out of my own way and sweating about the how. I don't know how it's going to happen. My ego could dictate that, but that's just my ego. So rather than being in pursuit, I'm more about being, like intending. But then being open to receive, and much more focused too on relationship and really exercising my right brain. You know, my intuition and all those things that I think for years, women were told were a sign of weakness, but are actually a great strength.

So deploying some of those quote unquote feminine qualities more confidently as a strength alongside all that masculine muscle that I already have. Like the determination and the focus, and going to go out there and get it done kind of thing, right? Does that make sense?

Debbi Dachinger:             It makes so much sense. And I really want to honor you, I wanna talk about a time when I got to see you be a champion around this subject. You and I, Melinda were in a master mind situation, we were sitting in a big square situation of tables and chairs, and maybe there were 30, 40 of us there, men and women all doing very well in our businesses. And the question on the table was here's where you're operating, we all wanna get better, make more money, give me a number, what number do you see yourself performing at, where would you like to be? And we went around the table, and we were quite around the table, and one of the things that happened was the women would say, “Half a million, two million,” whatever it was that they put out there where they wanted to be performing at within a year.

And then there was this eye, a sort of eye that was given like do you know what it would take to get there? Do you know how long it will be? Do you know how hard it could be for you to go from where you are to there? And nobody said anything until you called it out and said, “Women, stop acquiescing to this. Have some idea of what your worth is that you absolutely are capable and can create that level of money.” And just to notice the disparity between that none of the men got the eye when they called out a number, but the women did. And you were such a champion for us, and it was so important I thought that you called that out.

Melinda Wittstock:         Oh gosh, thank you so much. You know, it was this really interesting moment where I was speaking before I even know I was speaking. It was one of those, right? And I just thought, “God, this is interesting the women, the numbers seem lower from the women overall than from the men.” And yes, there was that kind of questioning like are you sure? Like how are you going to do that? And it's like hey, no, don't sweat the how. Play bigger; know your value. And you know it's so funny because I went on from there to not so long ago being in Montauk with a bunch of high performing female entrepreneurs in the tech space that need to raise venture capital. And women right now, depending on which stats you read, get anywhere between 2 to 3% of the available venture capital money in the United States.

Debbi Dachinger:             Wow.

Melinda Wittstock:         I know, right? It is 2018, the last time I checked, anyway. And that number, by the way, hasn't changed since 2000, so like 18 years that percentage has stayed the same. And more and more women have created businesses and all of that, so it just doesn't make sense. And there's been some really interesting research recently, that when women go to pitch a VC, they're asked what the researched called prevention questions. Whereas when the men go to pitch the VC, they're asked promotion questions. And the difference is this, a promotion question would be, “Hey, that's great, how are you going to scale?” So it's all kinda positive like we're going to do this, and we're going to do that, and we're going to do this. Right? The women are asked, “What makes you think you can scale this?”

Debbi Dachinger:             Whoa.

Melinda Wittstock:         Or, “Why are you different?” And this is true. And I know because I've gone out to raise venture capital before, so I know this personally. I've experienced this; I just didn't know that everybody else was experiencing it. For a long time I thought it was only me. And it's not. It's a really systematic thing, I don't know if it's conscious. I tend to think it's just unconscious bias. But I swear to God at this mastermind all of us practiced answering a prevention question with a promotion answer.

Debbi Dachinger:             Awesome, so you turned it around?

Melinda Wittstock:         Yeah. How to turn it around. It's so important for all of us to be conscious of that. When those things happen, and they can happen in a sales context, they can happen in a … Just interviewing on a podcast, they can happen in so many different ways. Certainly in raising money for your business, or whatever type of business you have where you have to talk money, or really understand your own value. And for women also, price themselves fairly, and not be nickel and dimed down. ‘Cause that's happened to me too, where you say, “Okay, here's my price.” And people are like, “Oh well yeah, but you can discount that.” It's like, “No I can't.”

But there's an assumption maybe that you're a woman so you should. And then maybe we give into that a little bit too easily as well. So that's also something to look at.

Debbi Dachinger:             100%, I've had the same experience as a coach, as an entrepreneur where not always, I mean I have a lot of people come and get the value and are just really, they're in. But the occasion when it happens, here's my frustration, I know that out in the world people actually do and buy what they really want. So if somebody's got an obsession with shoes, they're going to be buying a gazillion shoes and then they'll come up to a coach and go, “You charge what? Really?”

I've had the occasion once, I was with a friend of mine, we were in Bloomingdale's, and I know what she makes, I also know what she spends. So she has no problem going to a workshop and throwing down some big bucks, or hiring a coach, or getting in a program and throwing down the big bucks, right? We're in Bloomingdale's, she's showing me her favorite designer, she looked at the price tag and went, “Oh,” you know like, “Some day.” Like, “I can't buy this.” I looked at her I'm going, “Are you serious?” What you spend with some of these coaches and workshops this is conversely [inaudible [spp-timestamp time="00:50:16"] just to buy yourself this shirt or this sweater, it's a drop in the bucket. Of course you are worth this. If your insides are worth the growing, your business is worth the growing, then allow yourself this beautiful luxury too.

But I've seen this with people across the board. They've got this column of things they deemed okay to throw money at, and then these other things that they couldn't possibly, right? And I think there has to be a bigger conversation around that, that they learn the importance of really wanting and needing something that's going to forward them, get them forward, get them promoted, get them in the space where they want, and understand they're probably overspending in some pretty crazy areas that they could leverage to pay for this other thing.

Melinda Wittstock:         Oh gosh, yeah. No that's so true. And the other thing too that it's one of my personal missions, is to really encourage women to buy from other women, and not undervalue the services of other women. So I find sometimes men are more likely to pay the full price. And my theory about this is if you don't value yourself very much on some subconscious level, usually it is just a subconscious thing, it's harder to value somebody else. So it would be wonderful consciously if women went out and really invested in other women, and we lifted as we climb, right? By helping each other out. Throwing business to each other, investing in each other, all of that. So I'm so passionate about it, I can't shut up about it. But it really would be a wonderful game changer to do more of that.

Debbi Dachinger:             Yeah. That's a wonderful idea. And I like that. And it's not so hard, even if you can't hire someone to understand what they do and what they create, and then recommend other people who are looking for that service.

Melinda Wittstock:         Absolutely, absolutely right. Oh my goodness Debbi, I could talk to you for hours this is so much fun. A quick question though about what you do, because you help people really find their voice, you know, get their message out into the world, write books, do all these things, which is wonderful, and we're going to connect everybody to you so they can … I know so many women who do need help with all of the things that you do. So all your links and everything, so people can find you and work with you are going to be available in the show notes and we're going to talk about it. But before we get there, I just wanted to ask you what are the biggest impediments or challenges that you find when you're working with your clients that you have to really kind of pull them through to get them where they need to be? What's the challenge that you have getting your clients to where they need to be?

Debbi Dachinger:             What a good question, and I'm really sort of globally thinking, 'cause I do have a lot of private clients, and they are so different. Some I have there's zero bones, like nothing I could say 'cause I'm just so happy with the relationship. I feel like the one thread that I see men and women is that they get in their own way. One client I'm thinking of, sort of has a drama issue, to be honest. And he can get really worked up about stuff, to the point that he literally doesn't see the real reality there, and he's functioning in some other plane that is really almost everybody's against him, not working out, and he works himself up. And the good news is, is it came to a head this year. And actually he almost imploded a huge, huge opportunity for himself and his business. And I almost got caught in the wake of it too. And that was my reputation on line. So we had a come to Jesus moment. And he knew, he knew he really screwed up, he apologized, and I think it was a great lesson learned.

Don't wish that it had happened, but it was a good lesson. And I find there are other people like that, there's sort of a nervousness and anxiousness where they wanna control things, or be on top of, rather than just sort of a little more … It's not taking action I'm talking about, but just sitting back and trusting. Knowing that everything unfolds perfectly, that for me as a coach, I got this. I got you. Trust me. Just do this and relax. I'll get you everything you need, and there's a reason why the pace is like it is. So that's the only thing I really see, and actually that behavior creates against me.

So I have huge visions for my people, whether they're a group or a private, I see big things, and I know I'm taking them there. And when they start doing this drama sort of anxiousness and trying to control things, it stops me from creating as big and as easily as I could for them.

Melinda Wittstock:         Yeah, I mean it's so interesting. And I've found with a lot of people that I mentor and work with, people will come because they want to solve a problem. It's about money, or it's about personal branding, or whatever. But there is this resistance, and actually the coaching becomes really about mindset, and getting rid of a lot of the self-sabotaging behaviors even that stand in the way. So you think you're having a business conversation, or a business growth conversation and it's actually a personal growth one.

Debbi Dachinger:             Yeah. Thank you for saying that, because that's true. That makes sense. I think the real issue is resistance and it's just manifested in this behavior that becomes very sabotaging.

Melinda Wittstock:         Yeah.

Debbi Dachinger:             yeah, it's about I want this, let me get out of the way and let this happen.

Melinda Wittstock:         Yeah. Yeah. Oh, that's so wonderful. Well as I said, I could talk to you for hours. And you'll have to come back on again. But everybody, if you haven't already check out Debbi's podcast Dare to Dream, and we'll have all the links for how you can find that. And Debbi, tell everybody how they can find you and work with you.

Debbi Dachinger:             Thank you, I am at DebbiDachinger.com, it's D-E-B-B-I D, as in David, A-C-H-I-N-G-E-R. I'm a media visibility strategist, and I help you create a fierce and unique presence through coaching to write your book, get your book to guaranteed international bestseller, and get you scheduled on media interviews with really good results. I'm a certified coach, and basically I help people stop living in the shadows so they can stand out and fulfill their purpose. So you can contact me DebbiDachinger.com and then feel free; Twitter, Google, Instagram, all of them you can find me pretty easy, I have a unique name.

Melinda Wittstock:         Wonderful. Well Debbi, thank you so much for putting on your wings and flying with us.

Debbi Dachinger:             Thank you, you're my Shero.

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