553 Diana Goodwin:

What does it take to bootstrap a business into the millions? Pioneering something completely new…is challenging even with investment dollars, so what’s the secret to building a scalable business when you’re starting with only a couple of thousand dollars?

MELINDA

I’m Melinda Wittstock and today on Wings of Inspired Business we meet an inspiring entrepreneur who grew her first 7-figure business by finding early customers and co-creating with them to prove demand – and using revenues to build her technology and automate her systems.

Diana Goodwin is Founder & CEO of MarketBox, a B2B sales and scheduling software designed to solve the unique challenges of businesses with mobile workforces. MarketBox is a spin out from Diana’s first bootstrapped business AquaMobile, an on-demand swim lesson provider, which is now the largest of its kind in North America and Australia. The AquaMobile software gave her the opportunity to start and spin out MarketBox, destined to become what she describes as the Shopify for services

I can’t wait to introduce you to Diana! First…

Diana Goodwin is considered a tech innovator and thought-leader in marketplace businesses and the gig economy. The CEO and Founder of MarketBox, providing services businesses automated tools from scheduling to payments, Diana shares today how she leveraged all she proved in her bootstrapped first 7-figure business to spin out a grander global version that promises to become the Shopify for service businesses.

Diana has been profiled in Forbes, Inc., Huffington Post, Techvibes and Dragons’ Den, the Canadian version of Shark Tank, to name a few. She has won numerous business awards including Emerging Entrepreneur of the Year, Music – bring up softly under my voice and the Telus $100,000 Small Business Challenge.

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Diana Goodwin shares the secrets of successful bootstrapping, how to co-create with your customers, when to invest in technology and replicable automated systems, plus what it takes to run two companies for a time.

Let’s put on our wings with the inspiring Diana Goodwin .

Melinda Wittstock:        Diana, welcome to Wings.

Diana Goodwin:               Thanks for having me, Melinda. Happy to be here.

Melinda Wittstock:        Yeah, me too. You’ve had such an impressive career as an entrepreneur. I am impressed with your ability to bootstrap because this is something that so many women find themselves having to do even in the tech space, because we’re still only getting 2% of the venture capital money. How did you make a successful run of bootstrapping a business to over seven figures in revenue?

Diana Goodwin:               It’s funny because at the time I didn’t realize just what I was doing, right? I mean, I was building this business. I started building AquaMobile before raising massive VC rounds was a big thing, and it was the popular thing to do. So I was just building what I thought was a sustainable business, something while I have expenses and I’ve got revenue that I need to bring in to cover those expenses. So I just started AquaMobile with that mentality of saying, “Okay, what resources do I have in front of me that I can leverage? And how do I maximize every dollar that I have?

So in my case, I was lucky that I was able to get $3,000 government grant to start my business. It was kind of started as a summer company grant that you could get. And so I used that money to start getting my first customers. And then when I got my first customers, I then had more money that I could spend on other things. And so it was really about maximizing every dollar, seeing how I could turn $1 into $5 or $10.

Melinda Wittstock:        See, these are the fundamentals of business that a lot of people in business and startups don’t actually think about, which is confounding because it’s business. It brings me back to several years ago I was doing some consulting work for Tony Hsieh, the founder of Zappos. And he had put all this money into the Downtown project in Las Vegas to rejuvenate that and create this whole startup community.

And I used to hop on the phone with all these startups in the tech space and they described their product. A lot of them had funding or at least some seed funding or friends and family or something like that. And they’d go on and on and on about what their product did. And then after a while I would say, “Well, that’s great, but so who are your customers?” And there’d be this long silence. And it’s like, “Okay, I get it. You’re pre-revenue. So who are your target customers?” And I was stunned by how few had even thought about it, right?

Diana Goodwin:               Yeah.

Melinda Wittstock:        And so these just business fundamentals were just not even in consideration.

Diana Goodwin:               Well, and I mean, unfortunately, I think it’s just something that the media really gives a lot of attention to businesses that have raised these massive rounds, and this company over here has just hired another 100 people, a thousand people because they’ve raised a Series A, B, C worth $100 million plus as you start getting up into those larger rounds. And so I think people are programmed to think that that’s how it should be and it’s okay to run a massive, massive loss for many years. I mean, even Uber, right? When was the last time they turned a profit? I think never.

So it’s a different mentality and it doesn’t work for every business unfortunately. Not every business can go and run at a loss forever. And I think that was one of the things with AquaMobile. I wanted to make sure I had customers first and foremost. Were people actually interested in this business, in this service that I had to offer? And then once the answer was yes, you start learning from your first set of customers and you say, “Okay, well, I now know what their needs are. Let me see if I can build leverage technology somehow to automate certain functions of my business so that I can scale it.”

And that was what my vision was from the beginning is I knew that I wanted to make this massive across Canada, the US, going into multiple countries. And I knew I needed automation technology to do that, but in the early days it didn’t make sense to invest a ton of money into technology until I had that base of customers. And that’s exactly what I did. So every time I got more customers, I would then say, “Okay, well, I’ve now got this extra money. What’s the next best way to use it? Okay, I can invest this much money into technology. Great. Let me do that.” And I just kept building from there step-by-step.

Melinda Wittstock:        The keyword there is invest. And you were looking at it not as an expense, but as an investment, what’s the thing that’s going to allow me to grow the business, grow the reach, but being able to do it profitably at every step of the way.

Diana Goodwin:               Yeah.

Melinda Wittstock:        I mean, there’s so many people who come into business and they’re only looking at revenue, but they’re not looking at making their revenue profitable.

Diana Goodwin:               That’s right. On that note, when you were talking about your experience a couple of years ago and seeing all of these businesses and these startups. The good news is we’re moving away from this trend that was happening back then, but the trend that I think we both saw back then was businesses thought that they had to go and invest so much money in the technology first before they even started thinking about the customer side of things. And I always like to tell entrepreneurs who are just starting out, “See if you can serve your customers manually first before you go and automate it. Because if no one even wants your manual version of what you’re doing, then there’s no point going and spending hundreds of thousands of dollars or hiring a team of engineers to go and build you this software.”

I think the trend is shifting, and I think it’s also shifting in part because people are realizing that they don’t have to be a technology company per se. They have to leverage technology to grow their business, but they don’t have to first and foremost be a tech play to be a successful, exciting growing business.

Melinda Wittstock:        Yeah. So that’s such a Silicon Valley bias right there, right? So if you come at business thinking, “The only way I can succeed is to bring down all this money. And then the only way I can bring down all this money is if I’m some sort of pure play tech company and on and on and on.” And we can see how that’s happened. But I think actually even VCs now are looking much more at the business fundamentals. Certainly they do when women come to them to raise money because we tend to be asked more of those kinds of questions than a lot of men do. It’s interesting. So I know that you’ve also raised money for your second startup. And so what was the difference? How did you approach the raising of the money having been successful bootstrapping the first one?

Diana Goodwin:               Yeah, so I think there are a few things. So the reason, first of all, that … By the way, I never had any intention of raising money for AquaMobile. I didn’t think it was the right type of business. I didn’t think it would be the right move for a number of reasons. we were already growing profitably on our own. It is a seasonal business, and that doesn’t necessarily lend well for your traditional VC style investors. It just wasn’t something that resonated with me for that business. But when it came time to start my next business, MarketBox, which essentially kind of piggyback to incubate it you could say the idea and the seeds of it within AquaMobile.

That was actually going to be a much more pure tech play because it was going to now be selling software to other businesses, so to help other types of businesses solve the same challenges that I had within AquaMobile and now offering that up to them. And so I knew that I needed money upfront to really bring in the top talent when it came to engineers to get this thing architected the right way and built the right way from day one.

So in my case, what I did is I really leveraged the brand I built for myself personally and with AquaMobile and went out there and explained the idea to investors. The idea basically said, “Look, we have other businesses approaching us for AquaMobile software. They are struggling with the same problems. There’s no good software out there for service businesses with mobile workforces. There’s no good way for them to sell to their customers and automate the logistic side of things. We can do that. We’ve done it with AquaMobile. We know this market.” So I really played up my expertise in that area, why I was the right person, why my CTO was the right partner to go forward and start, why we could do this together.

And I’ve really leveraged that experience as a second time founder. I think that really helped, but I do think, to your point about women, there is this tendency more on the female side to not necessarily express verbally to potential investors this massive, massive idea. I think women for better or for worse tend to restrain what they think it could be as opposed to a male bias that I’ve seen. In this is generalizations, of course, but the male bias to go out and really give that big picture vision of just how massive this could be. That’s what tends to resonate more with VCs.

Melinda Wittstock:        Yeah. Well, they want to know that there’s some chance of getting 10 times their money, so they’re looking at it as an opportunity like, “How big can this be?” Because, say, if they’re putting in, I don’t know, $5 million, I mean, what are the chances that it’s going to be a $500 million company, right? And so without a big enough vision, it’s just not exciting to them.

Diana Goodwin:               Exactly. So I think that’s part of it. It’s women aren’t necessarily as comfortable selling themselves, selling their massive idea, and it can come across as, “Oh, this idea is not big,” which is not necessarily true. It’s just a different communication style I believe in most cases. And especially with the older school VC model, which was, “Okay, well, as a VC, we know that we’re going to invest in 10 or 20 companies. And we only expect one of them to knock it out of the park.” They were counting on all of those other ones to essentially drop to zero. And I am seeing a shift out there though. They’re starting to realize that’s not necessarily sustainable, and it’s almost a shame.

This is just a personal anecdote for me. It’s a shame that there’s all these brilliant ideas and creative ideas that then just get killed because it wasn’t viable as this massive $100 million revenue idea, but there’s still so much brilliant creativity. And it’s sad to see it just get killed.

Melinda Wittstock:        Exactly. I think that model is broken for women especially. I mean, there have been all kinds of interesting studies too, just even the question bias. So you do your pitch and the pitch is great and then come the questions. And there was a study done. I forget whether it was Harvard or MIT, but they surveyed thousands of pitches done by both men and women. And the men were almost always asked how they were going to maximize growth, and the women were almost always asked how they were going to mitigate risk.

Diana Goodwin:               Interesting.

Melinda Wittstock:        And so being aware of that question bias for women I think is just really important to turn a lot of those questions around, right?

Diana Goodwin:               Yeah.

Melinda Wittstock:        And so having raised money before in a number of my different startups, it’s a really interesting game, but I think you’re right that a lot of it is the vision and a lot of it it’s the attitude too, like not coming with a begging bowl. No one’s doing you a favor. You’re actually doing all the hard work, taking all the risks really. And you’re presenting an opportunity for other people to enrich themselves based on your work.

Diana Goodwin:               Exactly.

Melinda Wittstock:        And the minute you turn that corner in your own head, suddenly it changes and suddenly you start qualifying investors, making sure you have the right investors, that they’re aligned with your mission, that they’re people you’re going to be able to work with and partner with, but it is a complete mindset shift and requires a bit of confidence.

Diana Goodwin:               Melinda, to your point about making sure that we as founders are qualifying the investors. That was a huge thing for me. I wanted to be very particular with who I felt was the right fit. I didn’t just want to take any money. It would have been easy enough to go and get money from certain people, but it really had to resonate with me early on, and early on what was resonating with me was people that I knew within the tech community in both Toronto and the Valley who had good reputations, who I knew personally. I really leveraged those connections and it felt so much better. When I would talk to certain people and I didn’t feel a good match or vibe, I would just not go for it. And I’m really happy I made some of those decisions.

Melinda Wittstock:        It’s important to say no often, right? To say no if it’s the wrong investor or the wrong client or customer or whatever. Really know your own boundaries and know what you want. That’s another point that requires confidence or a really clear vision of what you’re actually building and what you’re prepared to do and not do. So when you were looking for investors, what were you looking for in the investors? What made them a good fit as opposed to a bad fit?

Diana Goodwin:               Yeah. So ideally, I wanted someone who could first and foremost understand what I was doing and understood the vision. If they didn’t understand the vision, I didn’t really want them to be a part of it. It was somebody who I thought would be good cheerleaders for myself and for MarketBox, people who I knew would just be out there ready to help spread the word and cheer me on and not be micromanaging me, looking for updates all the time, worried, “Okay. What’s happening?” Just people that could go and let me and the team do what we do best and let us make the money. That was what I wanted to. My goal is to help all of us share in the upside of this journey. And I wanted people that would let me just focus on doing that.

Melinda Wittstock:        Yeah, absolutely. And also money that comes with connections like, say, if you need to hire really rapidly or people who have connections to, say, a major strategic partner.

Diana Goodwin:               Exactly.

Melinda Wittstock:        Or a huge customer or something like that is really important.

Diana Goodwin:               Yeah. That’s exactly it. Somebody that I knew could bring more than just money to the table. It was all about bringing in the right strategic people, and even as I look forward to who would I want as my next set of investors, I’m very much keeping that in mind. If we do go and raise a VC round as the next round, I’ve been using this time getting to know those VCs and say, “Okay, well, who is a good fit? Who shares my vision? Who do I think can actually add value?” Because not all VCs can add value. They might not know your industry as well. They might just be a check. That’s not what I’m personally looking for.

Melinda Wittstock:        So there you were running AquaMobile that you built into this really successful company. It’s the largest of its kind in North America and Australia. So at some point though you said, “Oh, I have to go and launch this other company.” Tell me about that. What was the impetus there? Why that leap from AquaMobile, which is still a very successful company, it’s still going into MarketBox?

Diana Goodwin:               Yeah, it was a two-pronged thing. So the first thing that started to happen is other entrepreneurs or business owners started contacting AquaMobile asking about our software and saying, “Who built this for you? Because this would be perfect for my business.” So we started having businesses like mobile beauty service providers contact us, in-home … Excuse me, in-home music lesson companies, at home or virtual personal training companies. And so they needed a solution to manage all of their different service providers while combining it with a way to sell to customers so that customers could self-serve and therefore automate a big chunk of their business because that’s where a lot of time was getting wasted for these business owners and their teams. It was trying to match and figure out, “Okay, which service provider can I put with what client?” And trying to figure all of that out. It was just a mess.

And so we had figured that out and they saw this. So it was businesses approaching. And that was me realizing, “Okay, there’s obviously still a need for the software. After all of these years there’s nothing on the market that can really do what these types of businesses need,” which is why AquaMobile in the first place ended up building this custom software. And it was also at a point in my career where I was just being … I felt unfulfilled with what I was doing with AquaMobile. I felt like AquaMobile can keep surviving without me, and it really doesn’t need more than 5% of my energy. I just was feeling very stagnant.

And so when other companies started to come to me, I was like, “This is the bigger thing I need to be working on. It’s time for me to move on and do something bigger.” And I felt so much more fulfilled and passionate again knowing that I could share all of the knowledge I’ve gained building AquaMobile for almost a decade, learning about marketplace, businesses, E-commerce, all of that, and now being able to share that with other businesses to help those businesses grow. And that was the thing that clicked for me because originally years ago I thought that we would use our software internally to branch out into other verticals outside of swimming. But I personally didn’t have the appetite to start another marketplace itself from zero, but I knew how to do it and I wanted to empower other people to do it.

It was this just perfect mesh of things happening where there was a need for the software, and I figured that, “Okay, I can actually build my knowledge into the software and pass it on to other people and help them grow.”

Melinda Wittstock:        Isn’t that funny though how sometimes our previous companies really were the lab, if you were, the lab for the next company and the next company. There are these ideas and things that you’ve proven out in a previous company that start to translate. I know that’s definitely been my case on my fifth business. I can look back at all these different companies. It’s like, “Oh yeah, that one I proved out there, and that one I proved out there.” And it’s this interesting journey that you see in a lot of serial entrepreneur careers. What I love about this though and this transition is that you already had customers validating the idea. It was already an obvious demand and then your obvious expertise, which you had proven. It just makes so much sense.

Diana Goodwin:               And that’s why I wanted to make sure I had customers lined up first before I went off on this new thing hoping and praying that it would work. It was really, “Let’s get real. Let’s make sure that these customers are actually willing not to saying they want this, but let’s actually negotiate pricing and have those contracts or letters of intent. It’s proof to myself, proof to people that I wanted to recruit to join MarketBox and proof to investors that there is something here. This isn’t just a crazy idea because I’m not feeling fulfilled anymore with my previous business.” And so having those proof points really helped build the traction around MarketBox.

Melinda Wittstock:        So there you were, Diana. You’re not only a serial entrepreneur now, but you were a multi-entrepreneur for a little while. You’ve got these two companies going. What was that like to manage that transition?

Diana Goodwin:               It was challenging for a while. I did go a bit underground I would say where I was just so focused on that transition. I wasn’t putting my energy out socially as much, which I’m very social person typically. I really needed to go inside myself and just sort that out. So it was challenging, but it wasn’t painful at all because I knew that it was leading me to something better and bigger that I wanted. The AquaMobile team all knew about this transition and they knew what my desire was to go and build MarketBox, so it was really about building up the AquaMobile team and making sure there was, number one, the right team members in place and building up their skillset and over time slowly pulling myself out more and more, handing over more and more responsibility.

And now it’s at the point where I basically meet with them 30 minutes each week just to make sure that from a strategic point of view things are aligned. They give me an update on some key metrics of the business, and I trust them to go do their thing, and it works out really well.

Melinda Wittstock:        Yeah. That’s fantastic. So the tech piece of it, so you already really knew what the software was. Basically, you’re replicating it or allowing other people to replicate what you were doing at AquaMobile in the swimming space. So tell me a little bit about your clients and how they’re using your tech.

Diana Goodwin:               Yeah. It’s an interesting question because when we first started out, we were positioning ourselves as sales and scheduling software for service businesses with mobile workforces, so very much focused on the challenges of businesses with those mobile workers, so anything like in-home plumbers, or lawn care, or personal trainers, beauty technicians, music teachers. We have so many different industries.

When COVID hit, it forced us to change our product roadmap a little bit in that we knew that some of our customer’s revenue would go down to zero if they were not able to go into homes to offer their services. And so we actually added in a Zoom integration pretty quickly. By April, I believe we’d had it added so that businesses could at least sell online services through our platform still and do payment processing and so forth so that even if they could no longer go into the home to teach a music session or to do a tutoring session, they could still at least do it online. And they already had that E-commerce platform, because I think, as we both know, a lot of businesses got caught flat-footed not having any type of E-commerce or web presence.

And so an interesting thing has happened now that we’ve built in that Zoom integration. We’re now helping not just businesses with mobile workers, but businesses that want to become hybrid as we call it. So as an example, we’re working with a couple large fitness chains who are used to selling personal training sessions in their bricks and mortar locations. And yes, they initially transitioned to offering virtual services, but they didn’t have a good mechanism for their consumers, their customers to actually buy these personal training sessions online because they’re so used to selling them in-person. So we’ve actually helped them set up that E-commerce flow so that customers can self-book and take a look at who their different choices for personal trainers are and book and pay online. So it’s all done in a system now as opposed to the old school method of you just talk with your personal trainer at the gym. At the end of that session you figure out your next session.

When you’re doing things like having a proper schedule automated, consumers will actually consume more of something, so your revenue per customer actually goes up if you can keep them on a set schedule. And if you can make it easy for that customer to buy, you’re going to be able to convert more leads that come to your website into actual sales. And so those are all things that we’re helping brands do. Another example more on that hybrid side is working with a tutoring company who, again, used to go in-home and now helping them go hybrid and be able to sell both in home and online virtual tutoring sessions so that as things open up, they can go back into the home. And if things close up again because of pandemic-related things or just because consumer tastes and preferences have changed and they don’t always want to have in-person services, they can be hybrid and they can serve both types of clients. So those are some of the businesses we’ve been helping.

I’m naming some of the bigger ones here, but we even help businesses that are just starting out for the first time. That’s really exciting to see. We have a young female entrepreneur who is offering a combination of online and in-person pet care services, so things like pet grooming, veterinary services, and she’s using our system to test and see, “Okay, what do customers actually want? Do they want that in-person? Do they want that virtual appointment? Which services are the ones that are most enticing to clients?” So we’ve seen all sorts of different businesses come our way.

Melinda Wittstock:        This is amazing. I mean, I can really see the big vision here because globally there’s a need for this. And then when you add the pandemic into it, right, which looks like it’s getting much worse. All of Europe is all of a sudden in lockdown again. I mean, people’s behavior is really changing. People still need these services, but the whole business world is changing very quickly. So to what extent is the pandemic really an opportunity for you?

Diana Goodwin:               Well, that’s exactly how me and the MarketBox team look at this, right? It actually opened up an opportunity in some of these brands that we’re talking to. We wouldn’t be talking to them if it wasn’t because of the pandemic because the pandemic forced us to actually make our software even more flexible and therefore be able to cater to different use cases. I mean, I will say it can be a little challenging at times early on when your business can serve multiple industries and there’s multiple use cases for it. That can be a little bit challenging on the communication side versus when you have just something very simple and discreet for one particular industry and one use case. But that’s it. And I love seeing how people find us and they get creative about how they would even use our software.

I’ve even been talking about it with you on empowering consumers to then go and self-book with these brands. Yesterday a concierge company approached me and they said, “Hey, I would love to use your software as an internal tool so that when a customer calls me saying that they need whatever it is, a florist or a plumber or a roofer, I’ve got your system using it as a database. And I can instantly find the right person who can travel to their location. And I don’t have to spend all of this manual work calling around and figuring out all of the vendors availabilities and where they can travel to. I’ve already got that in the system.” So it’s really cool to see all of these different use cases. It’s just sometimes challenging to communicate just all of the different possibilities of it.

Melinda Wittstock:        Absolutely. So Diana, when you think of what the next steps are and how you grow this business, I could see this being a really massive business. What’s the trajectory or where do you want to be with it in five years? Do you know?

Diana Goodwin:               Yeah. I mean, I basically want to have the world think about MarketBox as Shopify for services. Especially during the pandemic, I think we’ve all seen how Shopify has just really, really taken their growth to the next level when it comes to E-commerce for product businesses. But I believe there’s a giant gap in the E-commerce experience for service businesses. So what started off as still a large idea of MarketBox to help the businesses with mobile workforce, now after the pandemic our mission we feel is even larger because we see that there’s no good way for consumers to even go and explore who the team members are, who’s going to be providing the service at different companies and helping them understand who those people are, who those options are and build trust with those different team members is to us a very important way of giving the consumer a better experience and helping to convert them into a happy customer.

Melinda Wittstock:        So you make it sound super easy. I know it’s not. What are some of the challenges that you’ve faced? Are there any in particular things that you’ve had to overcome personally like either in your mindset or just business or whatever?

Diana Goodwin:               Yeah. I mean, I think I started kind of touching on one of the challenges. I would say on the messaging side. Just as we have evolved into this what we see as a bigger and bigger vision of what we can be. I’ve communicated it to you at a macro-level, but really then communicating it the right way to the different customer segments. That can be challenging in the early days. So that’s something I think we’re working on and always constantly refining. I would say some other challenges are just it’s we are … I mean, we work so well as a team. That’s the good thing between myself and Blair, but it’s a big system what we’re building. It’s not a simple little one-and-done. It’s a constantly evolving software. I think that’s just in general.

We have this big vision and there’s so many things that we can tackle with this software. We tell ourselves, we’re like, “Look, this is not an easy software to build. Because if it was, somebody would have built it already.” There’s a lot of factors and considerations that happen behind the scenes when we’re building this that our users don’t see all of the thought and architecture that’s had to go into giving them that experience.

Melinda Wittstock:        It’s complicated. I know having built a lot of software and right now actually just even the Podopolo mobile app, how complicated that is, how much work has to go in and how far from where we are now, which is pretty sophisticated, to where we’re going and walking that gap. So when you can see as a founder what ultimately the technology is going to be able to do, what it’s already doing, how much thought, yes, into the user experience and into the design and into the backend information architecture, all that stuff. It is very complicated.

Diana Goodwin:               Yeah. There’s a lot of moving pieces that happen behind the scenes to make it look smooth. And I guess the challenge is we have got these so many visions of what the software can be, and it’s expanded much more beyond the AquaMobile software even now. And AquaMobile has actually become a customer of MarketBox and stopped doing in-house technology for themselves. So the MarketBox software has evolved beyond the piece that’s been done at AquaMobile at this point.

Melinda Wittstock:        What an amazing story. I love this. It’s very, very inspiring. So have you had to hire? Very quickly How big is your team?

Diana Goodwin:               Yeah, so right now we’ve got a team of eight people. The next area where we need to be growing is really on our sales and marketing team. We’ve got a very solid product, but we still need to spread the word more about it. When people hear about our software and they see it, they love it. We need to do more of that now. For the first while of the company’s history, we were really keeping it more quiet as we were building and testing with our first users. And now we’re at the stage where we’re just ready to shout it to everybody who we can help. And so that’s our next area of where we’re looking to grow.

Melinda Wittstock:        That’s fantastic. Well, I wish you the best of luck.

Melinda Wittstock:        So Diana, it’s so inspiring what you’re building and the value that you’re providing and can provide to so many people across so many industries. So I want to make sure people know how to find you and MarketBox and make use of what you’ve built.

Diana Goodwin:               Yeah. So please reach out. If anyone’s listening and you think that MarketBox might be able to help you or someone that you know, especially now. We’re really trying to get more businesses online, help them grow and think about new revenue streams during this difficult time. You can find out more about MarketBox at www.gomarketbox.com. You can also find me personally on Instagram @dianagoodwin. I’m also on Twitter @DianaM as in Michelle Goodwin. Yeah. And reach out and I’d be happy to help you or answer any follow-up questions you might have.

Melinda Wittstock:        Fantastic. Well, thank you so much for putting on your wings and flying with us.

Diana Goodwin:               Yeah. Happy to be here.